I thought it was extremely unlikely those bones were even from the same period as when the princes were in the Tower?
Anyway, the most likely explanation is that Richard was responsible for the death of the boys. After all, boys grow up to men, who would claim the throne or at the very least become the rallying point of revolt against Richard (and his then-living son and heir). For his own and his son's protection, the princes needed to disappear for good.
In my view . Yes Richard III did have a lot to benefit from it but he was not the only one. He had already bastardized them and locked them away. What harm could they have done .they were no longer in the line of succession?
I don't have an opinion I can really stand by on any of the top 3 suspects as all are plausible. For all we know they could have died from neglect or poor food or sickness and someone spread a rumour and when dicky found out they were dead hurriedly buried them so as not to be judged upon the level of care he may or may not have supplied to his nephews.
Hey Dan, I think I read somewhere that the royal family refused to allow the bones found in the Tower to be DNA tested. Do we know the reason that they would refuse this given the still popular interest in solving this mystery? If they didn't say is there any reason that you would surmise?
Was Edward IV not poisoned? I believe that to be true. The Woodville bunch are my prime suspects. Obvsly we’ll never know. But I do think RIII is ultimately responsible. Bucking ham is my prime suspect there. He was dead in 3-4 months so who knows?
Always vote yes for a bit of forensic medicine but I think it is the Church of England that is opposing, not the Crown per se. Which begs the question, who owns the contents of the urn - are the C of E the legal owners or are they just the custodians of all bodies on their turf? Bodies can be disinterred by order of the coroner, particularly in suspected murder. How far back do the powers of the coroner go and do they trump the church/crown? It is an unsolved murder after all.
I think that the bones should be DNA tested, it's the only way to solve the mystery of the fate of the princes. I used to firmly belive that Richard III did murder the boys, however, after reading 'The Survival of the Princes in the Tower, I am now left unsure.
I think that I agree whole heartedly with the Queen and her decision not to allow DNA testing. It does nothing but satisfy a morbid curiosity and could set a dangerous precedent of exhuming other resting places. Where does it end? When it comes down to it, you are never going to KNOW who killed them, absent someone finding essentially a signed confession. Let the remains, regardless of if they are the princes or not, to rest in peace.
Of course it was Richard, not by his hands, but his orders. He was seemingly pragmatic to his core and knew he had to do that to keep his crown and life. In his mind, I always imagined, there was no other choice.
The DNA would be interesting — if it turns out to be someone’s pet dog or unidentifiable dna it would at least mean many more books on the princes!
Let's say that they ARE the princes - where does it end? Before you know it they will want to dig up any number of other remains in order to satisfy scientific curiosity. To me it is the modern day equivalent of grave robbing.
Aliens! They took Elvis and the 9th Legion so why not the Princes too? I'm sure I've seen conspiracy theory TV series go by less... Pyramids are after all Alien landing pads... Nearly as far fetched as other thoughts so why not?
I do wish 'they' would allow DNA testing to be carried out. This would prove who they were, and if they are both there. DNA testing of Edward IV might prove if his father was not the duke, but that's just a pipedream too. However if his father was indeed an archer then again, the princes would not have a legitimate claim to the throne .
I admit to being influenced by theories surrounding their deaths but I do believe Richard is the most likely candidate. It is true though, that he is not the only person who would have benefited from their deaths. Henry Tudor would also have done so
Richard has been demonised for so many years, I would truly love him to be innocent.
I think it would be difficult for The Crown to permit testing on a personal level; as there is the thought they were once, kind of, your family members. Most digs/archaeology is testing on nameless, faceless 'just' bones/artifacts, whereas these are potentially not nameless bones. (I know all archaeological digs are completed with dignity it's just to emphasise a point!). It brings in to focus more what is being handled and so some reluctance? Plus, finding a female link may be difficult??
However, with such a dim and distant past and connection, plus even Richard was tested, maybe now its the time with such modern techniques to re-evaluate testing...
I thought it was extremely unlikely those bones were even from the same period as when the princes were in the Tower?
Anyway, the most likely explanation is that Richard was responsible for the death of the boys. After all, boys grow up to men, who would claim the throne or at the very least become the rallying point of revolt against Richard (and his then-living son and heir). For his own and his son's protection, the princes needed to disappear for good.
In my view . Yes Richard III did have a lot to benefit from it but he was not the only one. He had already bastardized them and locked them away. What harm could they have done .they were no longer in the line of succession?
I don't have an opinion I can really stand by on any of the top 3 suspects as all are plausible. For all we know they could have died from neglect or poor food or sickness and someone spread a rumour and when dicky found out they were dead hurriedly buried them so as not to be judged upon the level of care he may or may not have supplied to his nephews.
Spot on - why people persist in believing otherwise is the real mystery 🤔
Hey Dan, I think I read somewhere that the royal family refused to allow the bones found in the Tower to be DNA tested. Do we know the reason that they would refuse this given the still popular interest in solving this mystery? If they didn't say is there any reason that you would surmise?
Was Edward IV not poisoned? I believe that to be true. The Woodville bunch are my prime suspects. Obvsly we’ll never know. But I do think RIII is ultimately responsible. Bucking ham is my prime suspect there. He was dead in 3-4 months so who knows?
Always vote yes for a bit of forensic medicine but I think it is the Church of England that is opposing, not the Crown per se. Which begs the question, who owns the contents of the urn - are the C of E the legal owners or are they just the custodians of all bodies on their turf? Bodies can be disinterred by order of the coroner, particularly in suspected murder. How far back do the powers of the coroner go and do they trump the church/crown? It is an unsolved murder after all.
I think that the bones should be DNA tested, it's the only way to solve the mystery of the fate of the princes. I used to firmly belive that Richard III did murder the boys, however, after reading 'The Survival of the Princes in the Tower, I am now left unsure.
I think that I agree whole heartedly with the Queen and her decision not to allow DNA testing. It does nothing but satisfy a morbid curiosity and could set a dangerous precedent of exhuming other resting places. Where does it end? When it comes down to it, you are never going to KNOW who killed them, absent someone finding essentially a signed confession. Let the remains, regardless of if they are the princes or not, to rest in peace.
Of course it was Richard, not by his hands, but his orders. He was seemingly pragmatic to his core and knew he had to do that to keep his crown and life. In his mind, I always imagined, there was no other choice.
The DNA would be interesting — if it turns out to be someone’s pet dog or unidentifiable dna it would at least mean many more books on the princes!
Yes!!! The Endurance!!! I've been wishing to talk to you about that.
My sincere wish is that Charles will permit DNA testing now that Uncle Richard has been found -
If those skeletons in Westminster prove to be the real deal- puts an interesting spin on Thomas More’s account.
Let's say that they ARE the princes - where does it end? Before you know it they will want to dig up any number of other remains in order to satisfy scientific curiosity. To me it is the modern day equivalent of grave robbing.
Always ask: qui bono? And there's your answer.
He still hasn't found what he is looking for
I think Colonel Mustard did it, in the library, with a candlestick. 😉
Got to be Miss Scarlett
Aliens! They took Elvis and the 9th Legion so why not the Princes too? I'm sure I've seen conspiracy theory TV series go by less... Pyramids are after all Alien landing pads... Nearly as far fetched as other thoughts so why not?
Thanks for the heads-up.
I do wish 'they' would allow DNA testing to be carried out. This would prove who they were, and if they are both there. DNA testing of Edward IV might prove if his father was not the duke, but that's just a pipedream too. However if his father was indeed an archer then again, the princes would not have a legitimate claim to the throne .
I admit to being influenced by theories surrounding their deaths but I do believe Richard is the most likely candidate. It is true though, that he is not the only person who would have benefited from their deaths. Henry Tudor would also have done so
Richard has been demonised for so many years, I would truly love him to be innocent.
I think it would be difficult for The Crown to permit testing on a personal level; as there is the thought they were once, kind of, your family members. Most digs/archaeology is testing on nameless, faceless 'just' bones/artifacts, whereas these are potentially not nameless bones. (I know all archaeological digs are completed with dignity it's just to emphasise a point!). It brings in to focus more what is being handled and so some reluctance? Plus, finding a female link may be difficult??
However, with such a dim and distant past and connection, plus even Richard was tested, maybe now its the time with such modern techniques to re-evaluate testing...
Not knowing, also keeps the mystery going 😉